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I have been here in front of my computer most of the evening, catching up on my blog reading (I actually made it through my entire list tonight!), and something interesting occurred to me, inspired by Stephen Shields' blog entry for June 23rd, where he debates the relative merits of online vs. facetime relationships. Maybe it's just me, but there's something very "early church" about reading "The Epistle of St. Kevin to the Lexingtonians" or "The Apostle Alan's Letter to the Church at Cincinnati". Tongue in cheek, to be sure, but think about it. We read each other's writings as they become available, distribute what we receive (in the form of quotes) to other churches in our regions, and learn from each other what it means to follow Christ, even though we may only meet each other a few times a year (or maybe never, in the case of some of our brothers and sisters overseas). I'm not trying to make a case for online-only community, but I am saying that there is much merit (and a healthy dose of Biblical precedent) in what we are doing here. I'm not sure why I felt impressed to write this; maybe someone needs some encouragement not to lose heart, to keep on writing and sharing.
| posted by #Debi | 11:09 PM | |
In case any of our folks want to know - the problem with publishing the blog posts has been fixed - seriously - soooo, if you have been having problems, you will have them no more. Pax vobiscum!
| posted by + Alan | 10:06 AM | |
Thursday, July 25, 2002
Alan, I think the only thing we didn't do last night was blow smoke--we sucked up a good bit of it, second-hand, though. I'm sorry that I forgot the Chick Tracts, but the praise and worship was very exciting!! And it was way cool when Robert got up on the table and started preaching to everyone there. (Oh, wait, that was the parallel universe nightmare version. Never mind.) I think Common Grounds worship was a definite do-over (and over and over...). It was great seeing Linder Souzer again, and her sister was a great addition to the mix. Finally, another woman who's not afraid to speak her mind!
McCarthy's was cool, too; I'm just sorry I wimped out on my "half" of Guinness. The one really good thing about Guinness is, it fills you up way before it makes you drunk (at least, that's my experience). I think that if I were the type to have time to "hang out" in a bar, it would be one like McCarthy's (and not just because I'm looking for an Irish man!). It was a very relaxing, low-key kind of atmosphere, with pictures of the Founding Fathers on the wall (you know, Mick Collins and Dev and the boys).
As far as the discussion at Common Grounds goes, the one thing I took away that made the most impression on me was the "potluck" analogy that Linda made. Being a community is much like participating in a potluck dinner. Everyone has something to bring to the "table", and to fully experience the dinner, you have to sample a little of what everyone has brought. This means we all feed each other, and we all benefit from what the other folks have contributed. If someone in the group is famous for their sweet potato casserole and they don't bring it, then everyone has lost out on part of the "community experience." (I'm not sure if I'm saying this in a coherent manner--it's always a bad idea to start writing food metaphors just before dinner.) Anyway, the point is that we all have unique giftings to offer a community, even if we think we don't, and the community loses out if those giftings aren't utilized.
| posted by #Debi | 6:01 PM | |
Last night we did things a little different. We met in a local coffee house that we all like called Common Grounds. It has a great atmosphere. There were 8 of us with our good friend Linda from Cape Cod and her sister Cathy. We had a great discussion - more on the "rule of life" in Romans 12 - very good talk. Obviously we drank coffee too - and yes, cleaned up after ourselves and put money in the tip jar (please do this if you're going to sit in a place like that for 2 hours). We will be doing that again - we all really had a good time.
After, we stood out front talking for another while - some of us went home - then Debi, Matt, and I went to a local Irish bar called McCarthy's - very cool place. This is, by the way, not just a bar with an Irish name - it is seriously an Irish bar. There are times you can walk in and hear only Irish accents in this place. Anyway, more good talk, and one smooth pint of Guinness later, we went home. It was a good night with the community - living community. I hope somebody else gets on here and talks about how good it was so I don't sound like I'm just blowing smoke...
| posted by + Alan | 8:49 AM | |
Tuesday, July 23, 2002
OK, I'm FINALLY bloggin'...here we go......
Hanging out @ VBCC for the last month or so has really been a breath of fresh air. I've seen so much that just clicks with what's been inside of me for most of my life following Jesus (about 17 yrs). But for the last several years, even though I've grown & seen a lot, parts of me have shut down. When I first gave my life to the Lord it was in the context of community. I went on a youth retreat (callled Youth Encounter the Savior) without knowing hardly anyone there. But I found such acceptance & love it made it easy for me to see Jesus & how much I needed him. I wanted to experience what I was seeing. It was something worth laying down my life for . These people came from all walks of life but had this common bond. Soon after that weekend I became involved in a little prayer group with some kids I met at the retreat. The group grew from 5 of us to around 50-60 within just a few months. Most of these were teenagers like me. It was real community. It was messy. Fun. Exciting. We just simply got together each Thurs night to worship & pray for each other. This experience shaped me for the rest of my life. In good ways, but it also has made it hard for me. Most other church experiences I've had fell short of this community experience.
But lately God has really been chasing after me in regard to community. I think, in a lot of ways, I've romanticized it. I've longed to be in a group of friends where I can let it all hang out...be myself warts & all...and still find that love & acceptance. As important as that is, it's kinda one sided. Community is hard work (at times). We have to give. We have to allow people to finally point to some of those warts & say, "you know, that's really ugly. It's holding you back from being who you can really be."
Last Wed night we talked about Romans 12 in context of community. I've spent the last week chewing on that chapter & have been challenged with how little it's focused on me & my needs. It's much more about deferring to one another. offer your bodies as living sacrifices (v1). Do not think of yourself more highly than you ought.(v3) each member (of the body) belongs to all the others (v5) Be devoted to one another. Honor one another above yourselves (v10) etc etc
I've spent the last 9 months living in what was supposed to be a sort of communal living arrangement. But it's only worked out so far for 2 of us to share the house. Had some friends over Sun night & we started talking about relationships. My roommate (Joseph) & I started talking about different fights we've had. It was pretty funny. But we could see how for whatever reason (God?) we've both committed to this friendship & we've really slugged through a lot of issues. It's seems like it's kind of unusual for 2 guys to commit to a friendship at this level. Because we are so different, we've both given each other plenty of reasons to say "the hell with it" and quit the friendship. But God is forming a sort of David & Johnathan friendship.
I don't know why either of us have had the grace this time around. How many relationships have I let fall by the wayside, just because my needs weren't getting met?...or because it was just too much work?
Do I enter into a church/community looking for how it can meet my needs? Will I be fed? Will I like the worship? That's important stuff, I know. But is it the most important? Or is it like seeking 1st the kingdom of God & all these other things fall into place. Do we seek to pour ourselves into other people's lives & then find ourselves surprised at how much of our own needs are met in the meantime?
| posted by Matt | 10:50 PM | |
Sunday, July 21, 2002
I read Alan's blog for the day on his personal blog, and decided to check out Jeremiah Smith's blog. Understand that when I check out a new blog, if I like the initial entries I see, I scroll down to the beginning and read all of what's shown chronologically. It helps me get a sense of the person, and I'm maybe a little bit anal. Anyway, there's a prayer there on his June 14th entry that I liked really well, so I thought I'd reproduce it here for you:
My Lord God
I have no idea where I am going.
I do not see the road ahead of me.
I cannot know for certain where it will end.
Nor do I really know myself,
and the fact that I think I am following
your will does not mean
that I am actually doing so.
But I believe that my desire to please you
does in fact please you.
And I hope that I have that desire
in all that I am doing.
I hope that I will never do anything
apart from that desire.
And I know that if I do this
you will lead me by the right road
though I may know nothing about it
Therefore will I trust you always
though I may seem to be lost
and in the shadow of death.
I will not fear,
for you are ever with me,
and you will never leave me
to face my perils alone.
Thomas Merton (1915-1968)
Very good stuff!!!
| posted by #Debi | 1:39 PM | |
Saturday, July 20, 2002
Liz and I had a great time at the Leadership Community gathering at Vineyard Central last night - pot luck, hanging out, sharing about what was going on in our respective communities/house-churches. We shared with them how we were doing, thanked them again for retreating with us, etc. Good friends. Thank you God for connecting us with such real people!
| posted by + Alan | 10:38 AM | |
Friday, July 19, 2002
Heeey! We have comments now on the vine. Please interact with us. I think I'm now addicted to comments - now that I know how to get them on every blog I'm a part of - very cool!
| posted by + Alan | 9:21 AM | |
Thursday, July 18, 2002
Yeah, Robert!!! It must have been, as my dad would say, that "you just weren't holding your mouth right," whatever that means. Anyway, as Alan says, now you have no excuse."Pssst! Get a Mac!" :) I like what you said there, "just as the bread and wine...so are we joined to Christ without ceasing to be individuals..." That's good stuff--did you think that up yourself? I think I'm going to need to meditate on Romans 12 for several days before I'm able to even scratch the surface of what's there for us as a "rule" of life in community. What we discussed was very good, and deep, and deserves much more thought on my part before I try to pigeonhole it. One thing Alan said that I thought was particularly good was his differentiation between "conform" and "transform"; that "conformity" is an outside-in, more temporal kind of change, whereas "transformation" is an inside-out, eternal change. Good stuff.
I got a copy of the tape from my former church--the speaker's name was Desmond Frey (pronounced "fray"), and he's the dean of Rhema Bible Training Center in Bonn, Germany. I will post my notes from the tape on The Scriptorium, but one thing I will tell here. He referenced a couple of scriptures together that I had never thought about in conjunction with each other before; Isaiah 55:10-11 and John 1:1. Together they read,
"As the rain and the snow come down from heaven, and do not return to it without watering the earth and making it flourish, so that it yields seed for the sower and bread for the eater, so is my word that goes out from my mouth: it will not return to me empty, but will accomplish what I desire and achieve the purpose of which I sent it......In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."
This is also going to take much meditation to glean what God wants me to from it. What I have so far is this: Not only did Jesus accomplish all that He was meant to before He went back to the Father, but, in virtue of the fact that He lives in us, we will not go back to the Father before accomplishing all that He intends for us. This is very encouraging, but I am sure that there is much more that God wants me to learn through this before He's done with it.
Well, it looks like the Vine & Branches Singles Group (otherwise known as Brian, Matt, and myself) will be going to a Lexington Legends game tomorrow night. (They are our local "farm" baseball team and I have never seen them play. It should be fun.)
| posted by #Debi | 8:05 PM | |
test - good stuff Robert - we're so glad you have no excuse not to post now - I mean, that you can post now! :^)
| posted by + Alan | 4:37 PM | |
Okay! Hot dog! This is the first time I have actually gotten the blogger to work on my own without Divine Intervention (or at least Alan's Intervention).
Last night, we spoke briefly about religious communes. I commented that there were very few actually "orthodox" Christian communes out there. It seems like the ones that succeed are the wierdos! Think of all the communes and communal groups you've heard of--at least the major ones--and you'll see what I mean: the Shakers, Oneida, the Branch Davidians, etc. The Shakers believed Mother Ann was the female incarnation of Christ... Oneida shared sexual partners (or, rather, the leader "shared" everybody's wife if you want to be exact)... and so on. The real Christian groups falter more often. Why are the ones that seem to work and function the longest usually wacko?
Well, first, I think it's harder to be "orthodox" (ok, it's a really formal sounding word that gets people ticked off and thinking about nit-picky arguments over doctrine, but that's not what I really have in mind) and still hold a community of believers together in love. Unorthodox groups usually reject the Trinity. A quick study will bear me out on this point. Faith in the Trinity gives Christianity the vision of a perfect society existing in God. There is role-diversity but co-equality. Jesus can say his Father is "greater" than he is and that he "does his Father's will," while the two enjoy a basic, essential oneness and equality in Godhood, power and glory. That's a hard vision of society to bring into actual being. How many times do our leaders allow themselves to be "on the same level" as the people who submit themselves to them? How many times do we look at the different "roles" in our society as being different in terms of prestige? How often we try to "lord it over" one another! It is hard to bring the Trinitarian life of God into actual, social existence because it runs against the grain of all we've been taught. Cultic groups that throw out the Trinity (and the Incarnation of Christ too for that matter) don't have this problem: if you're an absolute Monotheist minus the Trinity, you have a totally different "vision" of the perfect society--one where an autocratic dictator sends down external laws to be obeyed. That "vision" of society is easier. It's the broad highway we find ourselves on each and every day in our culture, instead of the narrow one that Christ calls us to, the one where we must "in honor, prefer one another," let the "greatest among you... serve," and keep the "unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace."
Second, cultic groups often simply attempt to reproduce the personality of the leader within all the individuals involved. Our God is one, but is still three distinct Persons. Orthodox Christian teaching requires us to allow each other's creative impulses and opinions to interact. We've all heard that Proverb that says, "As iron sharpens iron, so a man sharpens his brother." Iron can only sharpen iron where there is some friction! When leaders hammer down on their followers and create a questionless environment where nobody ever disagrees, nobody gets sharpened! Sure, it's easier that way, but it accomplishes nothing in the way of spiritual progress. Friction wears down an engine, but without any friction at all an engine will never accomplish anything or move anything whatsoever. Better to occasionally have to change the oil and repair the parts than to let those parts spin forever without contacting or rubbing together and never move! Just as the bread and wine in communion become the body and blood of Jesus without ceasing to be bread and wine, so are we joined to Christ without ceasing to be individuals with distinct personalities, likes and dislikes. The high road of interaction and real community (instead of conformity to a list of rules and demands) is a hard, narrow road--exactly the hard, narrow road Christ called us to--and "few there be that find it."
Whether we live in a "commune" or simply interact as a Christian community, there's something to be learned here. When we let Jesus Christ be our example and the pattern for our lives, and the Trinity be our blueprint for society, we set ourselves upon a difficult but rewarding journey. Let's follow it, take the path less travelled, and find a better life in the place where it leads.
| posted by Robert | 12:42 PM | |
This is a test of the emergency blogger system. Relax, it's only a test.
| posted by Robert | 12:06 PM | |
Last night was good I think. Everybody else can chime in if they want. We did communion first - entering in through what Jesus did. We each went up to the "altar," lit a candle, said out loud something we were thankful for, and received Christ in the eucharist, went back and sat down to meditate. We sat quiet for a minute or two, then sang a song - great song by Dave Nixon of Vineyard Central called Your Mercy. Then we prayed for each other - layed hands on each other and prayed for whatever. We got some coffee and proceeded into a discussion of Romans chapter 12 as "a rule of life." Thanks to Mark Palmer of The Landing Place in Columbus, Ohio, a good friend, for being the catalyst for this talk. We looked at the whole chapter as one thought and saw an overall rule of life for Christians - from general laying your life down to God as sacrifice, to recognizing who you are, to living in community - in love for those inside - to loving those outside and living in peace. Good stuff! Then we hung out and had more fun as usual. That's it for now.
| posted by + Alan | 8:52 AM | |
Tuesday, July 16, 2002
test
| posted by #Debi | 8:55 PM | |
Sunday, July 14, 2002
Daggone it! I just had this great entry all typed out and went and hit the wrong button.......Oh, well, let's try again....
I had a very interesting lunch with some folks from the "traditional" church I came from to help with VBCC....they told me about the special speaker they had at church this morning. I can't remember his name, I think the last name was Frey and he was from Germany (ring any bells?)...anyway, he talked to them about the house church movement in Europe and how this was the "trend" now. His three main points were (get this!) living intentionally, living relationally, and living generously.Hmmmmmm......I plan to get the tape of the service and listen for myself; it should be a good one. I have to admit, I got amused at how excited these folks were about hearing these concepts (and, maybe a little superior, too. Mercy, Father!) I really hope they take the message to heart and realize that it was God's voice they heard today, but I know that this is a very difficult message for a "faith" church to get hold of. Pray with me that this sparks some positive changes.
| posted by #Debi | 10:39 PM | |
test
| posted by + Alan | 10:27 PM | |
I've been checking out some of the blog links on Alan's blog, and you all should check out Amber Bishop's July 5th entry at Whatischurch. I think we can all agree with her sentiments there.
| posted by #Debi | 10:06 AM | |
Thursday, July 11, 2002
Well, I see Alan has told all the stuff I was going to say.....man, you took my answer! Actually, he's right--it was a very good time. No mead or any other "enhancements" this time, but we still managed to get through it. :)
I'm really looking forward to hearing more from Todd Hunter and the others who spoke at the Search Party thing; what we heard last night was very encouraging. We listened to the talk on the "story" of the gospel not being merely about getting to go to Heaven when we die, but also about getting to live the story of Jesus while we're here. One of the major things I got from the talk was Todd's definition of "believe": to place one's confidence and trust in. I probably have heard this definition before, but it seemed fresh last night. There's a real tendency to say, "I believe in Jesus" in the same way as we might say, "I believe in gravity," as a head knowledge kind of thing. The real turning point is that heart knowledge of "I put my trust in Jesus, not just in the 'sweet by and by', but every day for all aspects of life." I know I have to consciously shake myself sometimes and say, "Hey, wait a minute! Who's side am I on anyway? Oh, yeah, the winning side!" That's not to imply any we vs. them attitude towards people, just towards God vs. Satan. Anyway, the concept of "story" was a good one to hear. Keep 'em coming, Alan!
| posted by #Debi | 7:51 PM | |
We met last night - good time. We talked about what was going on in our lives. Many times when we do this it's just regular stuff - not always wild and terrible things going on. Conor was bitten by a Rotweiler last week - doing fine - just one nice "puncture wound", as he likes to call it, in his right arm. Debi sang at a 4th shindig in Indiana and got to share with a family about her Grave's disease - how she is recovering from it - medicine being backed off, etc. Brian's having a hard week at work - worn out - Matt too - things getting hectic. Robert and Molly continue to plan on moving back to Tulsa in August, which, as the abbot, I have told them time an again is strictly forbidden - they're not listening!
We prayed a little while. Then we listened to Todd Hunter (who's coaching me in this church plant) talk (via CD) about "rehearing the Church's story" from the Search Party conference I was at in St. Louis in May. Very challenging, paradigm busting stuff. Then we talked about how we can live in that new story for a little while - good stuff. I think we are getting to a good place - understanding why we're here - what God is doing with us - how through our natural relationships with people, and not through some program, He will work through us to help people walk into His Kingdom Life.
| posted by + Alan | 8:43 AM | |
Monday, July 08, 2002
Great pictures, Alan! You and Kevin are so goofy! But it was a great time, hangin' out with the VC. I just got my photos back tonight--some of them turned out really cool--maybe we can get them up here, also.
| posted by #Debi | 8:37 PM | |
Sunday, July 07, 2002
I got some pichurs from the retreat to show you >>>>>
Lot's of fun, as you can see - food, craziness, worship, good conversation, helping us move along the journey.
| posted by + Alan | 1:57 PM | |
Saturday, July 06, 2002
Debi's gotta blog - Debi's gotta blog - woo woo wooooo >>>>
| posted by + Alan | 5:56 PM | |
Hi, it's me again. I just wanted to let you guys know that Alan helped me set up my own blog this afternoon. It's called The Scriptorium, and I'm so excited to have my own space to speak in, so I don't take up quite so much space here. I'm starting to notice that my entries here are getting longer and longer, so I thought it was time to have my own "venue". I'll still post here, too; just maybe not so many rabbit trails. (Maybe.)
| posted by #Debi | 5:02 PM | |
Friday, July 05, 2002
OK, I'm back again....just wanted to update you on the finding of the gunpowder guy and do a little Ashley McGlone-inspired venting on one of my soapboxes for a paragraph or two.
I was able to hook up with a friend of mine from work, Krasi Ianeva, and her husband, Boko, who are from Bulgaria, and we went downtown in Lexington to see the fireworks. Needless to say, this adventure started a bit late, since it's best if you wait 'til it's dark before you start shooting off those things. So we got downtown and staked out our standing spot around 10PM. We had with us one of Krasi and Boko's friends, Milen, also from Bulgaria, and it was a good time. I was amazed when I looked at my watch and saw that the show had only lasted about 15-20 minutes, because it seemed longer. There was so much packed into such a short time.
After the fireworks, we went to Milen's apartment, where Krasi had started dinner before we left. She is such a good cook! And, yes, we ate at, like, 11PM. Another of Krasi and Boko's friends, Zdravko (also Bulgarian) came over and we all hung out, eating and drinking Heinekens (OK, singular for me), and I got home at around 1AM. I had to be up by 6AM for work, so I was one tired puppy today. But I had such fun, it was worth it.
OK, now for the soapbox. I just finished reading Ashley's blog for July 1st (link above), and was inspired to look up an old book in my library that has a great quote in it. Ashley talks in his blog about how the church treats "disenfranchised" people, gays in particular. I e-mailed him with this quote from "AIDS: Ministry in the Midst of an Epidemic" by Wendall W. Hoffman & Stanley J. Grenz:
"While most Christians find homosexual practices sinful, we must nevertheless consider the extent that current attitudes toward homosexuality in society and in the church actually serve to compound the problem....To what degree are homosexually oriented persons driven to the gay community....because they are unable to find community within the wider society and more specifically within our churches? To what extent have we as Christians been guilty of sinning against persons with a homosexual orientation because of our failure to show love and to offer them the true fellowship they are seeking? The church is called to be a community in which fallen creatures can find fellowship and reconciliation with God and with one another."
Sharing this with you all is not meant to be a condemnation of anyone; rather, it is meant to be an encouragement to those who are reaching out to this group of people who desperately need to know that God doesn't hate them, but desires relationship with them just as He does with all of us. It is also meant to point out just how important this ministry can be. Lives actually hang in the balance, not just eternal lives but earthly lives. I guess I can get off the soapbox for now. If anybody has any comments, go to the discussion board and let's talk about it.
Debi
| posted by #Debi | 7:35 PM | |
Thursday, July 04, 2002
Hey, all! It's the 4th of July--which, in keeping with Alan's apolitical stand, is a great day to kick back, sleep late, catch up on some blog reading, and then go watch some guy blow up a lot of gunpowder! (Only a minor dig at you, Alan; you know I'm growing closer to your views on things politic every day.) We had a great time at the gathering last night--Alan actually "went short" and meant it (that's not why it went great, tho'). We did the evening office, which I'm still getting used to (where's the "three hymns and a poem"?). I enjoyed it; it was a good spiritual time and we discussed what we had read afterward, which I suspect is not always done with the traditional evening office. We missed Molly and Robert (things were much quieter, for some reason). I really wish they could have been there, but they're out in Tulsa, spyin' out the land. I have to admit that I'm really conflicted about this. I want God's best for them, and if Tulsa is what He wants for them, then OK; but I have really grown to love them both in the short time I've known them and hate to think of them moving halfway across the country. Thank God for the internet, I guess!
OK, I know I'm a website novice, but I really didn't know that Alan had his own blog set up. I should have known that one outlet wasn't enough for him! Anyway, I took some time this morning to go there and catch up on reading his "deep thoughts" (and also the not-so-deep ones). Re: the "love shack"; I read what you had to say and as I was, I remembered a song from the early 90's from a Christian band called Jacob's Trouble (anybody remember them?). Anyway, the song is called "Lovehouse" and I thought I would share the lyrics with you all so you know that the concept is not just an 80's phenom. Here goes.....
LOVEHOUSE
Love, baby, love is getting hard to find/Don't seem like much to go around/Peace, baby, peace is like a river/But it's been flowing underground too long/There's a place I know where we can go...//CHORUS: Come on down to the house of love/This is the house where love lives/Come on down to the house of love/This is the house, this is the place//Kick, baby, kick it back and stay a while/Forget all about your best laid plans, man/Shake, baby, shake it loose and celebrate/Lose your shoes and join the dance/Dance, dance, dance/Come on in and find peace of mind...
That's an abbreviated version, but you get the idea. So now I'm going to make myself presentable and go see Men In Black II with Brian and Matt--yee, haw!! Then I hope to hook up with some friends from work and see if we can't find a guy who's blowing up a lot of gunpowder. "It's a good thing," as Martha would say.
Later!
Debi
| posted by #Debi | 1:00 PM | |
Monday, July 01, 2002
Our retreat on Saturday was a very good thing. We appreciate very much Dave and Jody Nixon and Kevin and Tracy Rains from Vineyard Central for coming down to hang with us and infect us with some of their wisdom. We had a great time. We ate, talked, sang, worshiped, prayed, talked more - good stuff. We were very encouraged. I think it confirmed in us that we really are going in a good direction - we just had to see that we were. It was good to have that "outside" view. Connectedness is a good thing. It doesn't have to be institutional. Get some cool friends you respect and love to come look at you, talk to you, etc. It doesn't have to be some big fancy thing. Again, thanks to those guys!
| posted by + Alan | 10:53 AM | |